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Center for School Leadership at Baylor University
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Baylor MA in School Leadership
Jon Eckert:
Alysia, welcome to the Just Schools podcast. I want to jump right in with a question for you that I think is an interesting one for all educators, but I think particularly for you. But many of us in education have known we wanted to be in education since we were kids. What drew you specifically into education?
Alysia-Lara:
So my story is quite layered. But I'd start by saying, so as a child, my identical sister and I, we just loved playing schools. We both knew we wanted to be teachers. We would ask our dad to take on different roles as different students and we loved that. But she tragically passed away when we were six years old and something inside me just shattered and the loss was indescribable for me. And so, due to the trauma, I stopped speaking for about four years plus after that. And when I reflect on that, I think my silence became a form of survival. I was just trying to survive at that point.
And I think, subconsciously, I rejected that dream that we shared for being teachers because it was just too painful. So when it came time to choose a career, I went for medicine. I was one of those irritating A-star students so my dad encouraged me on that path. He knew how much I love children and thought I could lead in medical school in that capacity. However, I only lasted three months. The reality hit so quickly that I wasn't made for hospitals, blood, or sick people. So it wasn't the best space. But I had a conversation with my parents about that and I remember telling them I still wanted to work with children. So my mum arranged me to go back to my old primary school. And honestly, that was it. I felt God's call clearly for the first time in so many years. It was a really reminder for me of what He had placed in my heart from such a young age and education actually became part of my healing. But also, a way to honor my sister's memory.
Jon Eckert:
That's such an amazing story. And the first time I heard that, it was so moving for what you had been through, the tragic loss and the trauma that you experienced that you don't wish on any kid. And yet, this path that you found to education, which led you to the work that you do today, which I'd love for you to talk a little bit about what motivates your work that you do today specifically in education.
Alysia-Lara:
So today, I think what really motivates me is that radical potential of encounter. And by that, I mean by even the simple act of listening deeply to a student's story or a parent's fears or a colleague's hopes, that helps me to create spaces for transformation. And I think within education and within my role that I have, I'm able to do that and I'm really energized by what becomes possible when we bring children and young people into dialogue. And that's across different cultures and backgrounds and, also, involving other generations as well. So for me, in my role now, education is really a space where meaning and purpose is searched for. It's not imposed upon students. I remember loving my school. But I also remember not seeing people who looked like me in the stories or in the curriculum that I was taught and that really had a deep sense of impact on my identity. I didn't feel like I truly belonged even though I enjoyed my school.
So it was more about me assimilating rather than feeling included and I just wanted to really change that for other students. I remember what it's like not to have a voice but have words that I wanted to say and I want to make sure that I create spaces where I can lift up the voices of others. Particularly if they're from marginalized backgrounds. And I was reflecting recently that, for me, education is a Christian mission of hospitality. It's creating those spaces, honoring the stories, welcoming those on the margins. So it's really deeply relational and sacred work, that's how I view what I do. And so, we're offering welcome to others, creating opportunities. But also, having the humility to be changed positively by those who we welcome and that's very much about what I do today.
Jon Eckert:
Well, I love the generous hospitality you described because I really think as Christians, we should be the most hospitable people in the world as we welcome people in. And through the work that you're doing in the United Kingdom with schools giving students a voice, I think it's especially powerful because you, for over four years, did not have a voice. And so, I think it's helped you listen in different ways that a lot of us have missed because people like me are too busy talking instead of listening. And so, this next question really builds off that. What do you think students most need from educators as you listen to educators, students especially, and then speak to educators all over the world, in fact? But what do you think they most need from us?
Alysia-Lara:
Sure. I think it's a really great question. I mean, I'm very blessed to be able to speak to children from three-year-olds to 18-year-olds within my work. And what is so clear is that they just need us to be present. And that's not just physically, but emotionally, spiritually, and intellectually for them as well. And to kind of create spaces where these spaces say that you matter, you belong. You're not here to be fixed but you are here to be known, to know who they are.
And this can be obviously across curriculum but it also can be beyond that. And just enabling children to be able to ask big questions, to tell their truths and kind of wrestle with the complexity that we have today. I also think that what the students really need is not to be reduced to outcomes. So they're more than their achievements, it's that whole child that's in front of us and knowing that there is such a delight in the mystery of learning and becoming within education. So that's I think what I'd say for that question. Actually, there's one more thing, and this came from a child that I'm thinking of, to really cherish the uniqueness of each and every student and that came from a 12-year-old which I thought was really beautiful.
Jon Eckert:
That is beautiful. And you're remarkable at listening to kids and hearing that kind of common grace that comes through that, because that's how God sees us. And as His followers, that's how we should be seeing others because we're... Each is very different than some or all. It's that individual that we are created in His image and how do we see that and hear that and make sure they know that. And so, you had a conversation with a student that I love that you had shared with me at the conference where we met for the first time. You speak several languages and you had a student ask you a really good question about how you dream when you speak different languages. What language do you dream in? And so, could you share that interaction and what you told him?
Alysia-Lara:
Of course. I mean, I think the best questions come from children just before they're about to go to break time or what you would call reset. And then, they ask the question and they run outside. They're like, "What do I do with this?" Although this is about 15 years ago now, this question stays with me. And the young student who was aged seven asked, "Ms. Sirinda, if you speak two languages the same or equally, what language do you dream in?" That was such an incredible question because when I had time to think about it, I realized it wasn't just about language. This was about belonging. This was about identity, memory, home. And it reminded me that we're all layered in that our dreams, like our hopes, are often held in the languages and experiences that have shaped us.
So for me, that question really opened up a space of dialogue about culture. And actually, this young child, at seven years old, offered me hospitality in the form of a question and I've never forgotten that. So at the time, I did tell him that I needed just a minute to think about that. But I said that it depends on who was in the dream. For example, if it was my grandma, it would be in Portuguese because that's the language she spoke to me in. But maybe English with other people. But I think that question will always stay with me.
Jon Eckert:
Mm-hmm. And such a beautiful answer because in that, following up on the last question, what do students most need from us? They need hope. They need a sense of agency. They need a sense that they can become more of who they were created to be. And so, just the way you talked about dreaming, that's what we want for each kid, that they dream that they can become more of who they were created to be. But this next question is, you've worked in many countries, what do you think every parent and educator should know about students? So we asked you earlier, "What do they need?" But what do you think we should know? You have an audience of mostly adults listening to this, so what should we know about students from your perspective?
Alysia-Lara:
Yeah. I would say I'm... Whether it's England or West Africa or South America where I've been in senior leadership in education, what is really important is just to really know about their uniqueness, like I sort of alluded to. That every child carries a stories, they carry ancestry, some carry unspoken pain, but all have amazing potential. And these are shaped by lots of different things such as their faith, their community, the cultures they come from, what they really yearn to learn, and what they're searching for with regards to meaning.
But I think what is coming out most recently within my work is needing to acknowledge that the shift in how students are engaging today. So we know that social media and AI and are now deeply woven into how students see themselves and how they relate to others. Now, these spaces, they can sometimes offer connection and creativity and things like knowledge. But they also bring that pressure, that distortion, and sometimes can be harmful. So I think the educators and parents, it's really important to know that we can walk alongside them. They need us to walk alongside them in their journey. And we're in that space, not in a controlling way, but just to be there for them. And just reminded that for students, they're not determined by algorithms or likes that social media is kind of dictating, but who they are in Christ and help them to grow into that fullness of who they were created to be.
Jon Eckert:
Yeah. That's beautiful. And I think your point earlier about being present, that they need us to be present. We need to make sure that our devices, life around us is not distracting us from that embodied soul. That's the only immortal thing we're going to come across in a day. It's that individual. It's that relationship. And that's a really good reminder. And I feel like you have such a unique take on this because of your love for education with your twin sister and then the loss of your sister at six and then that long space of silence where you're surviving.
I feel like there is something that came out of that trauma that is this beautiful understanding of that and I think you see and hear people differently because of that. And so, when you think about that experience. And then, when you think about the best and worst advice you've ever given or received, how would you... I'm really curious to hear what you would say about this because I feel like you should have some really interesting insights into advice that was given to you as you went through... You've gone through really hard things or advice that you've given that's been helpful or advice that you've received that hasn't been helpful or what you've received that's been life-giving to you. So can you share either one? You can go whatever order you want. Most life-giving, most helpful advice, or least helpful advice. Take it away.
Alysia-Lara:
I'll start with the worst one and then I'll go to the best one. I think the worst advice I have ever been given was just to do my best to fit in. That made me shrink even smaller. It made me hide who I truly was. Real freedom came when I embraced my story and realized that belonging doesn't mean I have to blend in. Okay. I wasn't speaking, I wasn't articulating as other people were, but take a moment to look at my writing or the way I played my musical instruments. It's a whole different thing. So I think that's probably the worst advice I was given.
And the best advice, I think, I was given... I'm going to kind of turn this on its head a little bit, if that's okay. I'm going to say as the best question I've been asked is, "What makes my heart sing?" And that's what my grandma used to ask me every day, particularly after my sister passed, waiting for a day where I actually verbally respond to that. And I wouldn't always, I might hug her so... But I still today take time to think, "What makes my heart sing? What has given me joy today? What has given me life today?" And yeah, so within that, I think I've kind of turned that a little bit on its head, but just knowing that there's still joy no matter what we're going through.
Jon Eckert:
Yeah. I love that. I have a friend who talks about, "What stirs your affections every day? And I love that, that, "What makes your heart sing?" And that's what we want our kids to be able to articulate and identify. And so, we can't give what we don't have. And so, it's really good to be aware of that. So given that, the best and worst advice, which... Very good. And I like advice in the form of a question. I think anything that can make us think is helpful. But what do you think the biggest challenge facing students today is?
Alysia-Lara:
I think one of the biggest challenges that children trying to navigate are really complex, noisy, divided world where there's lots of political debates. There's turbulence for them as well with regards to, like I said, social media, AI, and how they see themselves which is causing lots of confusion to conform. External influence is saying who they should be. But actually, it's not about that. It's who they are in Christ. So they're often found that they're competing with different external voices and that's really hard for them. So it's about them knowing who they are in Christ. I think that's one of the biggest challenges. But also, having an unpredictable future. I think that's quite hard for them to navigate. But then, often, when I speak to children, it's still hearing those young voices who still lean into hope, even though they know there are certain challenges. But they know that actually they can make a difference, even in the spaces that they're in.
Jon Eckert:
No, that's good which leads nicely into the last question. What makes you most hopeful about our students?
Alysia-Lara:
I think their openness. Their openness and resilience is just so inspiring. Their willingness to question, to listen, and to connect across differences is so powerful. I think there's a lot that adults can learn from our students and they are really eager to build this sort of just and compassionate world. They show kindness and creativity and they truly inspire all aspects of my work.
Jon Eckert:
Yeah. Well, it's a great place to wrap up but so grateful for the work that you do and the story that you have to share. But more importantly, the stories you elicit from kids. Because I think that's one of the things, great leaders can tell a good story. But the best leaders elicit those stories from others and then make that part of the culture of the organizations they lead, so really grateful for that. So thank you for your time and for joining us today.
Alysia-Lara:
Thank you so much.
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